Students were ticketed for walking in the middle of the street near Manual High School again. And once again, Police Chief Steve Settingsgaard is tossing out the tickets. But I was intrigued by this statement at the end of the article in the Journal Star:
Settingsgaard said he is looking for better long-term solutions than issuing tickets. He has asked City Manager Scott Moore to investigate possibilities, particularly along Wiswall, that would provide a safe place for students to walk.
“One possibility might be to create a pedestrian/bicycle lane on one side of the street. This could potentially alleviate the problem without the tremendous expense or installing sidewalks/curbs/gutters.”
Some thoughts:
- How many sidewalks/curbs/gutters could we install for $39.3 million — the amount the council is desperately trying to put in Gary Matthews’ pocket? I guess a skywalk between the Pere and the Civic Center is more important than the safety of our city’s children. We keep spending money hand over fist to lure the ever-elusive tourist while our basic services disintegrate. You’d think the big push for the census would remind City Hall that residents are important, at least in terms it can understand — money. The more population we have actually living in Peoria, the more revenue we get from property taxes and federal/state appropriations. But if we keep treating our residents as second-class citizens and catering to the Almighty Tourist, it should come as no shock that people will choose to live in surrounding communities where they are more valued.
- While the city has a responsibility to provide for the safety of children, these students nevertheless also must bear some personal responsibility. In the absence of sidewalks, they should be walking next to the shoulder, not walking down the middle of the road obstructing traffic. The last time students were ticketed, they got their tickets thrown out only if they attended mandatory school assemblies where police officers and school officials tried to give students a “better understanding of the rules.” Furthermore, Settingsgaard said at the time — and this is a quote from the 2007 press conference announcing the jaywalking tickets would be expunged — “there will be enforcement in the future.” Now we learn there will be no enforcement, no assemblies — no accountability or consequences of any kind. What message does that send?
- I wonder how the police officers feel who gave out the citations. Having their Chief throw nearly all the citations out after he had said there would be enforcement in the future certainly sends a mixed message at best. It also might make me wonder what other laws the Chief would like not to see enforced, and for which people.
The message sent is the same message regularly sent to Manual students by Manual administrators, central administration, and board members. Students are not held accountable for their actions. All manner of excuses are offered–the culture of poverty being the one in vogue right now. Also, Martha Ross doesn’t want to hear any more bad things about 150 children. Who are the losers? There are other losers, but the students themselves are the biggest losers. I don’t understand why the adults who make the rules (and then don’t enforce them) feel that they are helping the kids become responsible adults. Parents as well as school personnel can discipline with love–only the love is stressed in 150; therefore, the love becomes permissiveness and does the young people no good.
They should take their azzes up to Bradley and write tickets. Why are they just sitting down on the south end of town ticketing students. People walk in the streets all over Peoria – in places where there are sidewalks.
What message are they getting when they are not ticketed? That they are better than the children who go to Manual? That they are above being harassed for the same thing black kids at Manual are being ticketed for.
Go Downtown and write tickets, go to Richwoods and write tickets. Go to Von Stuben and write tickets.
Children walk in the streets everywhere school is letting out – but it’s only a problem down by Manual. Really?
I drive two blocks around schools to avoid when school is letting out. These people who complain about not being able to drive when “these kids” are in the street, should know to take an alternate route during a certain time of day.
AND…. oh Sharon.
I’m not sure that’s true, Emerge. I’ve never seen any jaywalkers around Richwoods. Nor have I seen children walking down the middle of the street around Von Steuben — and I lived just two blocks from that school for almost 12 years. Even if it were true that “children walk in the streets everywhere school is letting out,” does that make it right? If enough children are breaking the law, is it okay then?
Bradley students do jaywalk a lot, though. You’re right about that.
I agree with Emerge that the jaywalking problem in the University and Main area is huge and enforcement would be a great idea. I’m surprised more people aren’t killed and/or seriously injured. As for Manual students, I’m all for communication and warnings. By all means, drive the point home that jaywalking and walking in the middle of the street isn’t the thing to do. However, if the problem persists, the cops should write tickets and let the chips fall where they may. That old adage about the burned hand teaching best does apply. If they want to jaywalk, then they need to know they could get ticketed. I will say that it might behoove the City to actually have some sidewalks installed in the area. That would be a lot better investment than giving a developer $40 million for a hotel we don’t need.
I assure you, in the neighborhoods surrounding these schools – children are walking in the streets. Children – people jaywalking is also a problem on Knoxville across from the Knolls – people are jaywalking and walking in the street all over town.
Additionally, how many of the children ticketed have parents who could even afford to pay a $200 ticket?
My point is – if they are going to sit down at Manual looking to write tickets for jaywalking – they should be sitting at other locations waiting to write tickets for jaywalking.
Yes, Bradley students are definitely guilty. Richwoods students would be killed instantly if they did much jaywalking–the main streets are very busy streets. Please remember that I did teach at Manual–that I did know that some (a noticeable number) students have always walked in the middle of the street instead of where they are supposed to walk. The worst part of it, though, is when students “defy” cars and keep them from moving. That does happen. It happened to me occasionally when leaving Manual–but the students weren’t always Manual students; they were younger kids coming from middle school, etc. Emerge, I understand how you feel–that the southend is the focus. I don’t totally disagree, but I do disagree that how other students behave needs to be an excuse for Manual students. I have heard this excuse recently at board meetings–wny pick on Trewyn and Manual when students in other schools behave badly, too. These young people need to stop being told they are victims. They need to be told that they can change how people perceive them. That said (and the reason why I keep hammering on this subject), a minority of students–many who are minority students–give the majority of students–the majority of whom are, also, black–a bad reputation. It is the majority of students who are harmed by the excuses made for the minority.
Question:
What are, if anything, the schools doing about the ‘problem’? I mean heaven forbid we should burden Dist 150 with any more problems, etc, but do the schools address this problem at all [as a safety issue, etc]?
Emerge, I have driven East on Northmoor Road (past Northmoor and Richwoods Schools)from Allen Road to Knoxville and then South on Knoxville up to War Memorial Drive at least twice a day for 13 years and I have never encountered a kid walking in the middle of the road. Sorry. In fact, if I did see kids doing this, I’d probably follow them home and tell their mother.
About Richwoods students–someone just told me that Richwoods students sometimes do jaywalk to cross over to the gas station on University. I believe there is something else to consider. I know students well enough to know that, when confronted, they will make excuses (just as the adults do for them and as we do for ourselves–human nature). If kids are walking in the middle of the street (as they do in the Manual area–these is no question about that), when the police car comes along, they will say that they were just crossing the street–hence, the ticket for jaywalking when, in fact, they were very likely walking a considerable distance in the street–not crossing it.
“If enough children are breaking the law, is it okay then?”
Yes. The problem is either lack of education OR the law itself.
“people are jaywalking and walking in the street all over town.”
Including Police Officers downtown.
I am so glad we have nothing more pressing than people walking to be concerned about, either for our Police or schools.
Diane, may I suggest you actually look for those students next time you are driving near Northmoor and University instead of using faulty memory to try and remember if you ever noticed them?
I truly think the focus should be taking off the “jaywalking”–or else punish everyone who does it. Just go to my church or probably any church on Sunday morning and watch people jaywalking to get to on street parking and/or parking lots away from the church. The problem at Manual really isn’t jaywalking at all–it is walking for blocks in the middle of the street and obstructing traffic. First of all, it isn’t safe for children to walk in the middle of the street–the issue is as much for their protection as it is about punishment.
I admit I’m confused. Are we talking about kids simply crossing the street, or walking down the middle of the road to get somewhere?
While I agree with Emerge about going to Bradley and issuing some jay walking tickets there and that there are other places too, the one thing that stands out here is this. (And this happened to me today) Yes Bradley students jay walk. They cross in front and sometimes run to the middle. They try to get across the street. Manual kids and the two I ran into today, walk down the middle of the street and when I tapped my horn, a young girl in a pink coat turned and faced me and gave me the finger. Then she and her friend proceeded to use the F word and every other swear word at me simply because I wanted to proceed down the street. I have never ever had a Bradley student stand defiantly in the middle of the street and give me the finger and swore at me. I say unless there is a license plate attached to their ass, ticket them and make it stick. Our police Chief is a pussy for letting these go. That is the difference. You may call it culture or being poor or whatever. I call it an attitude and no respect for others. You want respect, then earn it. I for one am tired of hearing the excuses and I am tired of the foul mouthed little shits like this girl.
Yeah these idiots are WALKING DOWN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD! Richwoods kids don’t dothat. Bradley kids don’t do it. Emerge why don’t you actually drive those areas before spouting off defending scofflaws. You’ll be the same person crying foul when one of these morons gets run over by a car. Its been a problem down there for years.
P.S. These kids at Manual aren’t only jaywalking, they are walking down the middle of the road. They, unlike other in this town, or simply not trying to get across the street. They are acting like they own the street. Man up Chief Settingsgaard and if Martha Ross doesn’t want to hear bad things about District 150, then she should get off your big rear and free up some real estate and go out and see what’s happening. She can’t be blind too.
I can attest that students walk in the street (NOT jaywalking, which I perceive as crossing the street not at a posted crosswalk) in the area around Peoria High and Franklin Edison school every day. And there are decent sidewalks there.
In the winter it is understandable that students have to use the streets to get to school as most sidewalks are not shoveled, but this continues all year long. And often after school it is not one or two students but groups of 4,5 or more completely blocking the street (with sidewalks on both sides). It’s about 50/50 whether they will move when they see you or if you tap your horn. And yes, sometimes I have been yelled at, sworn at and given the bird. Hopefully, none of these students will do that to the wrong person one day and get run over. Car trumps human body every time!
Note to Emerge–I can’t go around the school as I am either coming or going directly there! I would if I could, believe me.
I have held up my phone as if to take pictures of students in the streets when they block me. (I work at PHS) That is pretty effective. As far as the primary school kids, the ones I see in the streets are often accompanied by an adult. That is disturbing to me as it is teaching them that they do not have to follow the law in this regard.
The one part that bothered me about the PJS story was the quote about taking off the tickets because “we haven’t told them recently what is expected of them” or words to that effect (don’t have it in front of me). REALLY?? High school students don’t know that they shouldn’t walk down the middle of the street and refuse to yield the right of way to cars?? Should we also remind them not to touch fire or jump off buildings? Come on. These kids are 13-plus, not three.
“They are acting like they own the street. ”
That’s because that’s the only thing they do own… if you don’t like it, run them over. See how far that gets you. Remember, people were here before cars.
If one them flips you off or cusses you out, wave at them and smile. They aren’t impressed by your horn.
charlie: washing machines work hard. So what? I guess the simpleton method might work.
Charlie, are you really that laid back and understanding when or if kids block you when you are trying to get somewhere? I was probably fairly laid back because I did understand the “culture,” etc. However, I think it’s time that we stopped calling this “culture”–it isn’t black culture, so I hope that all stop thinking of it as culture that is related to skin color or experience or or poverty or victimization. Ownership of one’s own behavior is a great morale booster.
Emerge, I did miss the “Oh, Sharon” part the first time around–not sure exactly why you were calling me out. Maybe you were still talking about jaywalking. Do you in any way understand what I said about kids walking in the middle of the street using “crossing the street” as their excuse. They aren’t crossing the street; they are walking in the street. And I also missed the part about choosing an alternate route home. I can understand choosing another route (not always possible) to avoid the congestion of cars or the danger of hitting young children who accidently wander out in the street, etc. But no one, no one should have to choose another route because of the behaviors Emtronics described.
For years when I was driving around the southside, especially in the summer working for Headstart or Urban League, I never complained when I would often sit several minutes behind a car stopped in the middle of the street while the driver visited with someone. Often I knew the people and waved or visited with them myself. I knew that was “culture” and I honestly didn’t object. What we’re talking about now is something entirely different.
Sharon: I have the same “problem” on my own street. It is not a big deal. Sometimes when I am in a hurry I get frustrated, but I don’t get too bent out shape about it.
“it isn’t black culture,” no, it an urban thing, it isn’t about race, color or anything else… just urban.
I don’t understand it, and I don’t try to. I just accept it. We even have nice sidewalks on our street. Maybe they think that someone will think they are trespassing on their property if they use the sidewalk in front of other people’s homes.
Yes, it is culture. It isn’t instinct, it is learned behavior.
Charlie–Then it can be unlearned, right?
No tickets? Issue permits called “Parade” Then it is legal. Public works can block off streets, Police can escort them. No need to spend money on sidewalks the don’t use anyway. Problem solved.
My guess, D150 is too busy fending off criminal behavior and mismanagement of administrators to corral student behavior, whether it is in the classroom or in the streets surrounding them. When will it end?
Sharon, Of course it can be unlearned. But since our schools can’t even teach them to want to read, write or speak effectively, what makes you think they would learn anything else?
Are there sidewalks in these neighborhoods? I seem to remember a discussion a while back about the issue of there NOT being sidewalks and that often cars line both sides of narrow streets. Further, I really think that if this is the worst of the problems in these neighborhoods and schools, things really aren’t that bad.
I was just on my porch and saw four Calvin Coolidge students walking 4 abreast down the middle of the street. Most of West Peoria has sidewalks–relatively new sidewalks.
Sharon- I’d be interested in knowing how the County Constables approach jaywalking in West Peoria.
This isn’t jaywalking–it’s obstructing traffic. I think we should start calling it what it really is. However, I haven’t observed these young people refusing to move for oncoming traffic. However, since I live
around the corner from the firehouse, kids walking in the middle of this street are literally taking their lives into their hands if an emergency vehicle comes down the street–as they frequently do. West Peorians have an opportunity once a month to talk personally to the officer on duty in West Peoria at the Neighborhood Watch meeting. I’m sure that if obstructing traffic becomes a problem, it will be brought up and dealt with.