I haven’t read the health care bill, and I’ve only casually been following the health care debate in the newspaper and on the radio. So my and the dui weed lawyer firm thoughts on the subject are somewhat random and philosophical.
My first thought is, why is it the government’s job to “solve” the health care crisis? Why is the federal government looked to as the answer? If government gets into the health care business, is there anything they won’t get into? Unlike the bailout schemes, supporters can’t even appeal to the “hey, this is temporary” argument. No, this will be a permanent entitlement that will cost the country billions and billions of dollars. I know they can just print more fiat money, but you can only devalue the currency so much before it starts having serious consequences; I fear we’re past that point already.
Secondly, I heard President Obama on the radio defend the notion that private health insurers and viatical settlement providers could compete with the government’s health insurance. As an example, he pointed to, of all things, the way Fed Ex and UPS compete against the U. S. Postal Service. The USPS is, of course, losing billions of dollars a year, which I don’t think is the comparison Obama really wanted to make. But it was an apt analogy nonetheless, because it shows the lose-lose situation very well: If a government-run organization competes too well against private companies, then the private companies go out of business, which means fewer jobs; if it doesn’t compete well enough, it loses lots of money, which will cost the taxpayers.
I don’t know what the answer is, but when the government gets involved, often the cure is worse than the disease. The most recommended ailment for my stress is hemp oil. CBD oil has stress relieving properties that allows me to cope with things that stress me out.
Sounds like you would be in favor of eliminating social security and medicare, too?
For the people that do not want a public option, I would like to know your plan to insure people that do not have insurance because they can not afford it, and also, how to insure people that are uninsurable.
Also, talk to senior citizens you know and ask them how they feel about Medicare. I bet 90 % will tell you they like it. Why can’t we do the same thing for people that are uninsurable?
If the insurance companies don’t want a public option, then make them insure everyone regardless of pre-existing conditions at a fair rate.
Remember the insurance companies are the ones that are spreding nasty lies, like death panels, etc.
Insurance companies are in business for 1 reason only. To make a profit. They don’t care about your health, they care about their profits.
Bill — what you and fellow libertarians want is the Latin American model, where a few elite families own everything and absorb a huge percentage of the wealth, and the rest are left to fend for themselves, no public schools, no health care, no clean water, nothing.
But that’s the wrong approach for this modern, overcrowded USA.
Health care in a modern industrial nation is a public responsibility, as every other modern nation has realized.
Obama is right about the medical reform issues.
I agree with Elaine. I don’t have any idea how health care can or should be funded. However, I think we need to start with the premise that it is just the right thing to do. We all must realize that health care costs just keep going up and up–every year those who do have insurance pay more for that insurance. Where will this end? It seems that it will end with more and more people losing their insurance. Personally, I have a hard time accepting the fact that I am one of the lucky ones who has insurance–because I chose to work where insurance was one of the benefits. Why should I be entitled but others, especially those who work every day, be left out? There is just something so obviously wrong with the way things are.
Didn’t your family use public health care for a while?
I don’t get the “how should it be funded” argument.
Do we pay teachers “extra” if they have essay tests they have to grade, or outside projects they have to supervise? If a teacher has to put in extra effort to tutor or mentor a student, does that cost the school more?
Why should hospitals or any other “business” be any different? A doctor (nurse, aide, orderly, janitor, administrator, cafeteria worker, laundry worker, surgical tech, etc) gets so much money per year, month or whatever… if they have to do more one month than the next, with one patient more than the next so what? What is the product being sold? Drugs, surgery, or just counseling … what is the product? HEALTH CARE! Why should someone with a broken leg pay any more or less than someone with a cataract or brain tumor? Does it cost the hospital any more or less? Let me rephrase that, is there any significantly different cost in EXPENDED, NON-REUSABLE resources?
When are we going to realize that paychecks need to be about living and survival and not about STATUS. Do what you love and the pay becomes irrelevant. Would we look down on doctors or look up to them any less if they made $50,000 a year? Would they still not get preferred treatment in any social setting? Am I not as good of a teacher as someone who gets paid $75,000 or more a year? Am I not as deserving of health care, job security, income security and respect?
OK, the quick answer is drugs. Drugs are expensive… sure, but only because they are produced in a for profit, retail environment.
OK, the next answer is why should a surgeon, (or a specialist of any kind) be paid the same whether they do 5 procedures or 50? That answer is so obvious I can’t believe I have to answer it. The same reason why a salesperson at McDonalds gets paid the same no matter how many people come in and order hamburgers during their shift.
BUT education and training to become a doctor is so much more expensive than for a McDonalds person… (I actually know MDs working in retail) so maybe the problem is in the cost of education then. Why are medical schools SOOOOOOOOOOOOO expensive? Why are universities and colleges being run for profit?
[banging my head against a steel wall]
Where’s that bridge, Hedy, the river is down.
My “how it could be funded” just reveals my ignorance where money is concerned. I just assume that the powers that be can find a way as soon as they decide that funding health care is the right thing to do. Those powers found a way to fund NCLB–and it isn’t even the right thing to do.
People don’t buy health insurance because they can’t afford it. We will not turn away the uninsured when they need care at the emergency room. That raises the cost for the insured, or the emergency room closes. That raises the premium for health insurance. That causes fewer companies to offer health insurance. That again raises the premium for health insurance.
The government involvement in this is mandating that the emergency room cannot turn away the uninsured. Is this what you want changed?
Elaine: You walking to me? I’m a libertarian and I happen to be in favor of a public option.
I just don’t get how a puiblic option can be considered so wrong by people who are screaming and yelling at the government to keep their hands off of helath care.
“We will not turn away the uninsured when they need care at the emergency room. ”
Stabilize and release… that is NOT health care.
Again the conversation turns to cost and insurance… neither of which should be a consideration in what I consider a fundamental human right that should not be bought and sold. Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to send their children to school? Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to express their opinion in a public forum? Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford legal representation in a court of law? NO. These are fundamental civil rights.
Profitizing (I know its not a word) health care, education and other aspects of social justice has ruined these basic human services.
So what if wealthy people can now afford the best health care money can buy? They always have been able to and always will.
Ask the question: QUI BONO? If the answer isn’t everyone… wellllllll, there’s your answer. It isn’t a social program.
Since everyone is admitting to what they don’t “get” about the health care proposal I will share my frustration as well. I am confused by all of the fuss about people being uninsured or being unable to afford health insurance. Is that not the ENTIRE point behind Medicaid? If there are people falling through the cracks then repair Medicaid so that doesn’t happen.
Kcdad: Makes sense to me! There are some social services that no one questions–I think health care should be added. Remember the history of the Middle Ages on through until America had a “new” idea. Didn’t those early governments collect exhorbitant taxes and didn’t the peasants work for close to nothing–and weren’t the royals the primary recipients of all these benefits? I know I will be accused of leaning toward socialism–gravity occasionally does pull me in that direction. But isn’t it wonderful that we can live in a country where we can “pool our resources” so that we can help each other by offering public education, health care, roads and highways, etc? We all act as though our tax money really stays in Washington, D.C., or in Springfield, etc. I would be the first to say there is misuse–that’s a whole different problem, but don’t we get quite a bit of that money back in services. Most of us probably received a public education–we may be paying it back for others now, but when we needed it, it was free. The problem is that most of us want our pet benefits, but then balk at paying for one else’s pet benefits.
Bravo11: Afford… again the argument and questions are phrased in terms of MONEY. Stop the merry go round and realize that money IS the problem. Our money is intrinsically worthless and most of it is held in the hands of a very few people who determine its extrinsic worth. The rest of us are spending our very short lives scrambling and fighting each other to get the crumbs that fall from the table. Jesus condemned trickle down economics 2000 years ago.
“gravity occasionally does pull me in that direction.”
GREAT choice of words, English teacher. You are dead on right.
We spend a lot of energy trying to fight the inevitable. FLAP YOUR WINGS HARDER! lol
Many people, but the time they go to an Emergency Room for care, it is too late.
It is embarassing that the USA can not provide health care to it’s citizens because so many people in Washington, our elected leaders are more concerned about insurance companies, then the American people.
The health care-forgive me, the stabilization and release- the uninsured receive at the emergency room is government mandated. Because of cost shifting, it inflates health care premiums, leading to less health care coverage. This is bad.
The government could quit mandating coverage at emergency rooms for the uninsured. Let ’em die. This would also be bad. Especially for the uninsured. But it would get the government out of this aspect of health care, if that’s what you want.
Or we could look at Canada, England and France. No groups over there are lobbying to replace their health care with ours. Perhaps involving government in our health care, as we already do with Medicare, the VA, and the military would be a better way of handling health care.
“No groups over there are lobbying to replace their health care with ours.”
That might be true, because the wealthy can already come here and purchase whatever health care they want.
Insurance companies… aacchhh ptoi!
Paul: “No groups over there are lobbying to replace their health care with ours.” Great point! We keep seeing these ads on TV with Canadians complaining about their health care. I know I’ve been smart to believe that these people are paid well to pretend to be unhappy with their health care. However, it is a great point that the general public aren’t screaming for change in their own countries. Maybe they don’t have freedom of speech. Ha!
KC, Jesus did not condemn trickle down economics that is a stretch even for you. He did however promote social entrepreneurship.
I was gonna offer up my opinion on this first because I have one and second I am gasp that CJ hasn’t kept up with this issue. I mean he picks right down to the garbage at the school district, can count every penny over at city hall (and I agree with CJ on his opinions in the city finances) and he is very knowledgeable on most local issues.
This health care is a mess but I think Paul here said it best; “Or we could look at Canada, England and France. No groups over there are lobbying to replace their health care with ours. Perhaps involving government in our health care, as we already do with Medicare, the VA, and the military would be a better way of handling health care.”
Those countries have better health care than we do and we out spend them 10 to 1. We are ranked 37th in the world of modern industrial countries when it comes to health care. We need reform and to those that think the government can’t do it, well, they do it very well for the military (it’s Congress that screws the VA) and Congress themselves enjoy high quality health care at the government trough.
I laugh at those at these town halls that are clearly over 65 and say they don’t want the government in their health business yet those people collect SS and Medicare benefits. Government funded health care. Then there are those that say there aren’t enough doctors to take care of everyone if this health reform passes. So, what, we say let these people die?
Emergency rooms are full of poor people, on aide, getting treatment for their baby’s hangnail at 2 am. That is not what an emergency room is for but they can’t refuse treatment and they don’t have to pay upfront, so that is where they go.
I have health care which is paid from my employer (approx 75% of the premium) and it was great when I needed it but I had to get permission from my insurance company before I got an MRI or a lab workup to make sure they OKed it. I don’t know about the rest of you but I’d rather have a doctor decide if I live or die rather than “Lucy” the insurance specialists at Blue Cross.
The UK and Canadian health care systems do have some serious issues. Canada recently allowed individuals to begin paying for private insurance. Ever wonder why so many Canadians give up and come to the US for routine care and surgeries even though they have to then pay for that care? It can take months to get many surgeries approved and scheduled. We have heard all about it with one of our relatives who lives in Canada.
Why do you think Canada spends less, per capita, on health care than the US? They do not receive the same level of care… Be careful what you wish for.
Emtronics – you will not get the Congressional plan and they won’t have to be on the public plan that they want to force you into.
11Bravo–social entrepreneurship–what? That is a stretch. I completely concur with Kcdad. From all we know about Jesus, I don’t see any way that he would ever advocate an economic system of haves and have-nots–a system where the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. He acknowledged that mankind seems prone to such a system–but condemned it. He spent most of his earthly ministry healing people. You may say his miracles were to prove himself as God. Well, there are many things he could have done to prove that–he could have overthrown the government. He could even have performed his healing miracles on the rich. But, no, he healed the poor. It is absurd to think that we should follow his example? Probably so, most of what Jesus did seems absurd to the natural man.
Oh Yeah, I see throngs of Canadians crossing or borders for health care. Bull!
I have some good friends who live in Rouleau, SK,CA. They don’t have a problem with their health care and guess what? They go to a dentist too!
Sharon, I am not sure where the last 95% of your post was going BUT please show me in the Bible where Jesus addressed trickle down economics?
The compromise talk is already starting on this issue. I’m sure the health care industry is going to come out just fine on this issue.
Keep in mind folks… there are TWO fundamental issues going to this healthcare quagmire.
1) Is universal coverage. The trend is toward fewer and fewer being covered with less and less coverage. The current iteration of the Health Care bill seems to be chiefly aimed at this point.
2) Is runaway cost increases. Health care costs continue to rise well above the inflation even in times of economic downturn. The result of years of accelerated cost increases is that we have the highest cost per capita in the world. Our current system is deeply inefficient. The ‘free market’ of health care is not bringing down costs. I don’t think the current iteration of the Health Care bill really addresses this. That the private health care industry is supportive of the bill suggests to me we really need to look closely at this. I don’t think the current bill is going to control costs and still meet universal coverage. The only way to do that imo, is a single payer system, which currently is not on the table.
I saw a comment on another page about Canada’s health care. This lady said her daughter fell of her bike and broke her arm, here in the US. Her medical bills were $17,000.
Her husband was working in Canada and became very ill and had to spend a month in a Canadian hospital, with heart problems. His bill $50.00 and that was because he had to pay to park his car in the hospital garage for a month.
You may have to wait for elective procedures in Canada. How long do the uninsured wait for necessary procedures in the USA? The health care issue in the USA is fine, if you have insurance that allows you and your Dr to make medical decisions. If you are unisured, it isn’t as great.
I voted for Aaron Schock for Congress, and Barack Obama for President, but I have sent emails to both of them telling them I will not vote for them if there is not a strong public option. I already know Schock will not vote for it because the republicans are in the pocket of the insurance companies.
Read the story of Lazarus and the rich man…. in fact read it out loud to yourself.
KC, it has nothing to do with trickle down economics.
Now, certainly it concerns how we should treat people less fortunate than ourselves but it doesn’t jump the shark to your statement.
Interesting: Trickle-down economics: The term has been attributed to humorist Will Rogers, who said during the Great Depression that “money was all appropriated for the top in hopes that it would trickle down to the needy.”[2]
I’m sure Kcdad was speaking to the “spirit” of the expression not the “letter of the law of supply-side economics” since Jesus didn’t have much to say about modern-day economic systems. However, his principles are applicable and ageless. The story of Lazarus and the rich man seems to me to speak eloquently to a Christian’s reason for wanting health care for the poor. Just substitute rich man for “Madoff” and the story comes to life.
If I may offer some thoughts,
Privately-owned FedEx and UPS are not even comparable to the USPS. Unlike USPS, FedEx and UPS determine their freight rates based on market forces. Both have extensive international service. In addition, UPS has a substantial business in handling heavy freight (auto, engine and machinery parts, etc). Ironically, the USPS has contracted with FedEx to handle its air shipments since 2001.
Government-run health care is a bad idea. It will either bust the budget (even more than it has been) or lead to rationing. No nation should attempt to ensure health care for all. While no solution is perfect, a reduction in government mandates, elimination to barriers on competition and tort reform are the keys, as are crackdown on fraud and money-saving new technology. Of course, the ultimate solution is Medical Savings Accounts.
kcdad,
Personally, I think you’re insane, but I challenge you to prove me wrong with your own interpretation of the story of the rich man and Lazarus.
David: Are you new to the “let’s attack Kcdad” club. We all used to belong, but gradually many of us have been won over by this man who makes us think. I’m trying to figure out why anyone can’t see the correlation between the Lazarus story and the argument for and against universal health care. Maybe Jesus’ other words “He that hath ears to hear, let him hear” apply.
Sharon said, “I’m trying to figure out why anyone can’t see the correlation between the Lazarus story and the argument for and against universal health care.”
Why stop there? Based on that story, shouldn’t you give up your home, your pension, etc. to help those less fortunate?
Health care costs will continue to out pace inflation as long as “non-profits” like OSF are allowed to continue their relentless pursuit of redundant and unneeded new buildings.
Here’s a 2 day old article from the Canadian Press:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5jbjzPEY0Y3bvRD335rGu_Z3KXoQw
One should read the entire article. Here is the first couple of paragraphs:
Overhauling health-care system tops agenda at annual meeting of Canada’s doctors
By Jennifer Graham (CP) – 2 days ago
SASKATOON — The incoming president of the Canadian Medical Association says this country’s health-care system is sick and doctors need to develop a plan to cure it.
Dr. Anne Doig says patients are getting less than optimal care and she adds that physicians from across the country – who will gather in Saskatoon on Sunday for their annual meeting – recognize that changes must be made…..
Medicare and medicaid and the decisions made under them are part of the reason there is a healthcare crisis in this country. Through these programs the government sets reimbursement schedules that are then followed by the private insurers and the effects of this are felt throughout the system. The government decided to reimburse specialists at an extremely high rate, primary care at a very low rate. This has occurred for decades. Result? Many specialists, especially in fields like radiology, few students go into internal medicine/family practice. There’s a huge shortage of primary care doctors, so even people with insurance can’t get into their doc. Result? They go to the ER, where they receive very expensive care for minor conditions. Reimbursement issues also explain all of the doctor owned surgi-centers, which duplicate very very expensive equipment already available at hospitals. An inefficient and expensive result of government policy. I agree we need some healthcare reform, but 1) the rush to push through a plan before anyone fully understands it and its ramifications just ensures more unintended, stupid results, and 2) look at the healthcare delivered by the VAs. That’s government run healthcare and I want no part of it.
Lazarus was not allowed to have even the crumbs form the rich man’s table… the dogs got them. They trickled down to the “strongest” fighting for the leftovers. When they die Lazarus is with Abraham (in the bosom of…) meaning he is found worthy, while the rich man is sentenced to be tormented for eternity for participating in that “you fight over the leftovers” scenario… interestingly they can see and talk to each other, proving that this isn’t about some afterlife heaven and hell or any other myths of Greek paganism.
This is about if you have two coats give one to the poor, if you are asked to go one mile, go two. Yes, Jon, the implication is that nothing is “owned” but instead everything is shared. All belongs to God, and we are to share and share equally with all.
Die to self. Deny your self. What do you think they mean?
An opinion should be the result of thought, not a substitute for it.
– Jef Mallett
mdd!
A quick search discovers:
“Dr Doig’s got a pedigree when it comes to medical politics: her father was among the physicians who opposed NDP premier Tommy Douglas’s creation of medicare in 1962, and her brother Chip will be the 2009-10 president of the Alberta Medical Association.”
“Dr Doig has accomplished what she has in those areas while also making time to have six children, own a grain farm, swim competitively and stay involved with swimming tournaments.”
Opposed medicare? She is an elitist and obviously is in this for the political power. She’s an advocate for the elite…
How much time does she devote to medical practice I wonder??????
http://www.ratemds.com/doctor-ratings/44130/SK/Saskatoon/Doig
hard to get in to see her She doesn’t phone back when you leave a message for her to call.Doesn’t seem to go out of her way to find out what is wrong with you Is not overly friendly and caring-very standoffish. I ended up in the hospital just about lost my toes because she didn’t believe me that i was really ill hospitlized for seven days and off work for a further 3 weeks due to her misdiagonzing a badly infected toe. I continued to see her, ended up with bronchitus a year later had to go to emergencey to have it diagonsed.Went to see her after meds done for follow-up couldn’t get in to see her had to see someone else who told me she would tell dr. doig that i had been in. I was sick for 5 weeks and in those weeks went in twice couldn’t see her had to see someone else who just pushed me off.I have changed doctors,my new dr.treated me with respect and caring got me healthy.I had been seeing Dr.Doig for 27 years found it hard to leave familiarity but had to for my health and well-being.
Dr. Anne’s office was recommended to me from a friend and She was the only female doctor in the clinic taking new patients and I was expecting so I thought I would give her a shot. Well everything was ok until I was enduced and ended up having an emergency c-section my daughter was born completely healthy and a big baby she was but it seemed to never occur to her that I was having a large baby and that I might have complications she arrived to check on me once before the operation and I felt much safer in the hands of the intern! After having my daughter I couldn’t walk for almost 3 weeks from complications and was very sick I ended up having blood transfusions which 7 years later still have blood problems. In the nearly 3 weeks I was in the hospital she saw me once! And afterwards I could never get into to her again she was always to busy. We had thrush for 3 months because of the disorganization in her office and continual misdiagnosis. I would not recomend her to anyone to all!!
Here’s an article from The New Atlantis defending a free-market solution to health care. It’s kinda long, but give it a fair reading. Even if you don’t agree with his conclusion, it does give you some things to think about. Here’s just a portion of it:
Link to Canadian border crossings for health care treatment/consultation
http://publicplanfacts.org/2009/08/canadians-crossing-border-escaping-government-run-health-care/
kcdad: Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to express their opinion in a public forum?
Hummmmm interesting sentence. It seems at least in Peoria that some people feel that it is to expensive to express their opinion in a public forum.
Just another reason that I enjoy CJ’s efforts to keep The Peoria Chronicle open for lively discussions so that people can afford to express their opinion in a public forum! 🙂
kcdad: “This is about if you have two coats give one to the poor, if you are asked to go one mile, go two. Yes, Jon, the implication is that nothing is “owned” but instead everything is shared. All belongs to God, and we are to share and share equally with all.”
Absolutely. No arguments that this is the way it should be. But these were designed by God, not a few hundred bureaucrats.
I know of a faith-based health insurance program (Samaritan Ministries — it was written up in the PJStar a couple of years ago): families contribute a set premium based upon the size of their families and will receive funds to cover their expenses as needed.
kcdad says, “Again the conversation turns to cost and insurance… neither of which should be a consideration in what I consider a fundamental human right that should not be bought and sold.”
Okay, let’s assume that health care is a fundamental human right. The next question is, how much health care? Is that a fundamental right to life-saving health care, like emergency services? Or is it a fundamental right to free aspirin whenever one has a headache?
Your gave three examples (emphasis mine): “Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to send their children to school? Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to express their opinion in a public forum? Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford legal representation in a court of law?”
The answer to these rhetorical questions is “no.” But these questions are specific. You asked about sending one’s children to school. If you were to ask, “Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to attend college as adults?” the answer would be “yes.” You asked about expressing one’s opinion in a public forum. If you were to ask, “Is the question ever asked whether someone can afford to broadcast their opinions on national television during the Super Bowl?” the answer would again be “yes.” And, of course, no one expects the federal government to guarantee your right to a free attorney to help you draw up your will or a real estate sale agreement.
In all these cases, there are limits to our “fundamental human rights.” What should the limitation be for health care?
11Bravo writes,
“Sharon, I am not sure where the last 95% of your post was going BUT please show me in the Bible where Jesus addressed trickle down economics?”
New Voice[me[ writes,
King James Bible: Matthew 22:15-22 Mark 12:13-17 Luke 20:20-26
New International: Matthew 22:15-22 Mark 12:13-17 Luke 20:20-26
“Then he [Jesus] said to them [Pharisees], “Give to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.”
This is where it starts………………….
NEW VOICE: What is Caesar’s? Money… an economic system… exploitation of workers and slaves… nothing that Jesus thought was a part of the Kingdom of God.
I think the teachings of Jesus are clear… nothing belongs to Caesar and everything belongs to God.
Etymology: Middle English rendren, from Anglo-French rendre to give back, surrender…
“Alzheimer’s Disease and Cost-effectiveness Analyses: Ensuring Good Value for Money?”
…from the co- founder of Center for Medicine in the Public Interest, Robert Goldberg.
Good value???
http://www.cmpi.org/about-us/board-of-directors/
These are 6 sigma style managers.
Who are these guys and why should we listen to venture capitalists telling us about health care?
The President and founder of this “nonprofit” is Peter Pitts formerly of
http://liberty.pacificresearch.org/
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Peter_Pitts (Lamented the withdrawal of VIOXX from the market…)
Peter Pitts, also did not disclose that he has drug companies as clients. Pitts was on the show as a former FDA official, although he now earns earned a living as an svp at Manning, Selvage & Lee, which handles some diabetes work for Eli Lilly. (Pitts is now at Porter Novelli.) Lilly makes Prozac, and the show in question was devoted to antidepressants. Pitts’ link to Lilly was not disclosed …http://industry.bnet.com/pharma/10001493/npr-producer-gets-apology-over-goodwin-affair-says-peter-pitts-not-upfront-about-ties-to-eli-lilly/
Let’s try using reason instead of listening to “experts” who wish to lead us around by their titles and credentials.
http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/swine+flu+1976/video/x9ucqf_swine-flu-lie_news
Remember 1976? Experts will KILL you. Be reasonable… thoughtful… critical.
kcdad:
I think that you like Grandpa in “You Can’t Take It With You.” Correct?
Is that one of your favorite movies?
kcdad,
As expected, you twist scripture to justify your communist beliefs. You failed.